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00:00:00 --> 00:00:03 Welcome to your Booster Shot from the AWB Education Network.
00:00:04 --> 00:00:08 This podcast series is our opportunity to dive even deeper into the topics and
00:00:08 --> 00:00:10 skills that will help you lead your school with confidence.
00:00:11 --> 00:00:15 Check out information on our partners along with additional resources and services
00:00:15 --> 00:00:19 at www.awbeducation.org.
00:00:19 --> 00:00:21 Now, here is your Booster Shot.
00:00:22 --> 00:00:26 All right, I am here today with Jim Wichman. Jim, thanks for joining me today.
00:00:26 --> 00:00:29 We're going to talk a little bit about your work with Inspired Edification.
00:00:30 --> 00:00:31 Can you tell me a little bit about what that is?
00:00:32 --> 00:00:35 Inspired Edification is an LLC that my wife and I kind of put together.
00:00:36 --> 00:00:40 We started off as working with aspiring administrators, and we saw kind of a cause that went there.
00:00:40 --> 00:00:44 I actually had a good buddy of mine, Jeremy Brayden, work with us on that.
00:00:44 --> 00:00:50 And that kind of evolved into really more of what we're doing locally and nationally. Okay.
00:00:50 --> 00:00:54 Now, you've been in school leadership for a long time. Talk to me a little bit
00:00:54 --> 00:00:57 about that path through school leadership and where you're at today?
00:00:57 --> 00:01:00 What's got you here? What's made Jim Witchman, Jim Witchman?
00:01:01 --> 00:01:05 That's actually a scary and good question along the way. There's been a lot
00:01:05 --> 00:01:10 of people and instances that have built me to who I clearly started in Ottumwa,
00:01:10 --> 00:01:12 and we'll get back to that a little later on.
00:01:12 --> 00:01:15 But really, I've been a school administrator for 25 years.
00:01:16 --> 00:01:18 Majority of my time has been spent in the middle school. That's really where
00:01:18 --> 00:01:19 my heart is along the way.
00:01:20 --> 00:01:26 Although it wasn't planned, a lot of my journey have been around systems that
00:01:26 --> 00:01:30 might needed to be right the ship, I guess you would say, right the ship academically,
00:01:31 --> 00:01:32 culturally along the way.
00:01:33 --> 00:01:37 And really that's kind of led me to every location I've ever been ending with
00:01:37 --> 00:01:40 my time here at the last middle school I was at. Yeah.
00:01:40 --> 00:01:47 I mean, the job of educational leadership is hard and it changes constantly, constantly.
00:01:48 --> 00:01:52 Why do you think that is so critical to have good, strong leadership?
00:01:52 --> 00:01:55 And then also, how do you continue to grow as a leader?
00:01:55 --> 00:01:59 So leadership has grown. I mean, when I think about 25 years,
00:01:59 --> 00:02:02 what it was, I can also say what it was five years ago.
00:02:02 --> 00:02:06 I evolved from a lot of different lessons. Some of them were from the School
00:02:06 --> 00:02:10 of Hard Knocks, but I've been really surrounded by wonderful humans.
00:02:10 --> 00:02:14 And I got to really shout out to all the assistant principals that I've worked with. Of course.
00:02:15 --> 00:02:19 Mostly because they helped me see a different light or a different lens.
00:02:20 --> 00:02:25 A majority of the people who have built me into what I was as a school leader
00:02:25 --> 00:02:27 have been female leaders.
00:02:28 --> 00:02:31 Clearly an underappreciated, in my mind, population population.
00:02:32 --> 00:02:36 If it wasn't for them, I wouldn't be the person I am today with just a ton of lessons.
00:02:37 --> 00:02:42 But the fact that they leaned in, they honored me enough to tell me what their
00:02:42 --> 00:02:45 lens looked like. And then I had to reciprocate that.
00:02:45 --> 00:02:49 So when you ask the question about leaders today, there are a lot of things
00:02:49 --> 00:02:50 coming at our principles.
00:02:51 --> 00:02:55 Clearly make no mistake about it. When we have so much coming at us,
00:02:55 --> 00:02:58 it becomes very difficult to filter out and keep our own perspective.
00:02:58 --> 00:03:01 And what happens is we feel guilty because we're servant leaders.
00:03:02 --> 00:03:05 We feel guilty for putting ourself at the center and taking care of ourself.
00:03:06 --> 00:03:10 So you heard a lot about like work-life balance and how do we establish that? Of course.
00:03:11 --> 00:03:14 I was terrible at that when I started off. I mean, I was terrible at it. Yeah.
00:03:15 --> 00:03:19 So I don't think I was at the center. Heck, my wife and kids weren't even at the center. Yeah.
00:03:20 --> 00:03:25 And I think there's guilt there, obviously, but I don't want the current people to feel that way.
00:03:25 --> 00:03:29 I think if I would have had someone to help coach me, like, now this is the perspective.
00:03:29 --> 00:03:33 You don't have to be the first one at school every day. You don't have to be
00:03:33 --> 00:03:36 the last one. Take your Superman cape off. Take your Superman cape off. Absolutely.
00:03:37 --> 00:03:39 Set it right next to your ego. Yeah. You know, that kind of like,
00:03:40 --> 00:03:44 and I think that perspective is really what I set out to do.
00:03:44 --> 00:03:48 So I stepped away from being a school principal. I think it was 2022.
00:03:49 --> 00:03:53 And I remember sitting at my desk as a fall of 21 thinking about,
00:03:53 --> 00:03:54 I have to do something different.
00:03:55 --> 00:03:58 We have so much white noise that's coming at our teachers, telling them how
00:03:58 --> 00:04:01 to do their job or what, what an education. I shouldn't say teachers.
00:04:02 --> 00:04:05 And our educators are so dang humble that they sat there and they just took
00:04:05 --> 00:04:07 the pounding over and over again.
00:04:07 --> 00:04:11 And they would say things, I don't, it's okay. It's okay. Well, it's not okay.
00:04:12 --> 00:04:15 Politician is not who I wanted to be, but I didn't need, I needed to do something.
00:04:15 --> 00:04:19 And right now I want to disrupt the educators. I want them to be celebrating.
00:04:19 --> 00:04:22 I want them to be letting people know what they're actually doing.
00:04:23 --> 00:04:27 It's crazy about this. going through the pandemic, we'll think 2020,
00:04:28 --> 00:04:32 kids had to go home and everybody wanted the kids back at school because they
00:04:32 --> 00:04:35 were the trained teachers. Isn't it right? Remember that? Absolutely.
00:04:36 --> 00:04:42 Two years later, all of a sudden, everybody who has not been in a classroom
00:04:42 --> 00:04:46 becomes the experts telling us what books to read, how to do it,
00:04:46 --> 00:04:47 how to teach, what to teach.
00:04:48 --> 00:04:52 And then, by the way, navigating all the behaviors of our kids that are struggling with as well.
00:04:53 --> 00:04:58 I want to get in and help people celebrate all the work we're doing.
00:04:58 --> 00:05:02 And maybe, maybe if we kind of like get this celebration happening,
00:05:02 --> 00:05:05 we become form like a vibration that goes up and we start working together.
00:05:05 --> 00:05:08 And then all of a sudden we start silencing the outside, the white noise.
00:05:08 --> 00:05:12 Now as a principal, I did, I feel like I did a pretty good job of protecting
00:05:12 --> 00:05:14 those that I served at the last school.
00:05:15 --> 00:05:21 However, I want it bigger and better. I want this, I want to impact all of the
00:05:21 --> 00:05:24 systems to make sure that people know that they matter and that what they do
00:05:24 --> 00:05:27 is worthy of celebration along the way.
00:05:27 --> 00:05:29 As you can see, I get a little excited.
00:05:30 --> 00:05:33 So I think the reason you're excited is because you defined your why.
00:05:34 --> 00:05:37 Now, we talk about that a lot with leaders about how do you define your why?
00:05:37 --> 00:05:40 And if you don't really know what that is, that might be the first part to start
00:05:40 --> 00:05:43 at, right? Like you've really got to determine that.
00:05:43 --> 00:05:48 What got you to your why? I mean, you can feel the passion from you. What got you there?
00:05:48 --> 00:05:52 How did you get there? It was probably 2018.
00:05:52 --> 00:05:56 So I've been a principal for a while. Yeah. Then I had an instructional coach
00:05:56 --> 00:05:59 at the school I was at say, Jim, I think they need to hear your why.
00:06:00 --> 00:06:04 And I got to tell you, I hated it, despised it when people would say,
00:06:04 --> 00:06:06 who's your why? What's your why? What's your purpose?
00:06:06 --> 00:06:09 Remember your why? All that. I hated it because I don't know if really people
00:06:09 --> 00:06:11 understood what that really meant.
00:06:11 --> 00:06:13 And so I was challenged to do it.
00:06:14 --> 00:06:17 And I kind of really did a lot of thinking over that winter break and came back
00:06:17 --> 00:06:21 and shared. It was the day back. I think it was 2019, 18, something like that.
00:06:22 --> 00:06:29 And really, it came down to this. I have a single mother raising four kids in
00:06:29 --> 00:06:30 a town called Otomo, Iowa.
00:06:31 --> 00:06:36 And in that town, it is, they may not have a lot of things, but what they do
00:06:36 --> 00:06:40 have is true grit and care for the people that live in that town.
00:06:41 --> 00:06:47 And I remember that school district never once judged my mom for not being there
00:06:47 --> 00:06:49 in the morning when we went to school.
00:06:49 --> 00:06:54 Didn't judge my mother once for not being there at home when the kids got home.
00:06:54 --> 00:06:58 In fact, it was just the opposite. I remember a sixth grade student,
00:06:58 --> 00:07:00 back when we had half the kindergarten.
00:07:01 --> 00:07:06 The principal would pay me to be the, what do you call it, safety patrol during
00:07:06 --> 00:07:08 the lunchtime for the kindergartners.
00:07:08 --> 00:07:12 Five bucks. I didn't know where that money came from back then. Sure. I do now.
00:07:12 --> 00:07:17 Yeah. I know exactly where it was. Or Friday night football and the teachers
00:07:17 --> 00:07:20 or someone would reach out to my mom and say, hey, Jimmy's got a game at Fairfield.
00:07:20 --> 00:07:25 Teresa, do you have a ride for him? Yeah. And just making sure that she got
00:07:25 --> 00:07:29 there because everybody knew she wanted to be at all of her kids' games. Yeah. Yeah.
00:07:30 --> 00:07:33 And I could go on and talk about the Larry Zolkies of the middle school who
00:07:33 --> 00:07:38 made me feel like I belonged as a human. I could talk about all the teachers
00:07:38 --> 00:07:41 at the high school that no matter how many lemons I gave them,
00:07:41 --> 00:07:43 they returned a glass of lemonade.
00:07:44 --> 00:07:48 There was a scholarship, teaching scholarship, whatever the case is.
00:07:48 --> 00:07:52 And someone said, Jim, I knew I was going to be in education since probably
00:07:52 --> 00:07:54 eighth grade. Jim, how come you didn't apply for that?
00:07:55 --> 00:07:58 I looked at him and said, because my GPA isn't high enough.
00:07:58 --> 00:08:05 They looked at me and said, sit down, fill it out, apply. Now, I won the scholarship.
00:08:06 --> 00:08:11 Lesson there is we have to see the human before the title the human before the
00:08:11 --> 00:08:16 GPA the human before name all that whatever it is we got to see the human I
00:08:16 --> 00:08:20 didn't really understand that then sure maybe it felt as pity whatever the case is but.
00:08:21 --> 00:08:27 I believe every, every student to my being needs to have that same experience
00:08:27 --> 00:08:29 that I did at a community school.
00:08:29 --> 00:08:36 They were there for my whole family. They were there for my mother and they still are today.
00:08:36 --> 00:08:41 It's amazing, amazing group of people. I don't care what school district you're in.
00:08:42 --> 00:08:47 And I would venture to say across the country, those stories are there,
00:08:47 --> 00:08:51 or at least certainly could be. The opportunity for that story is there.
00:08:51 --> 00:08:55 And I know that school leaders, we're always trying to just manage all of the
00:08:55 --> 00:08:57 fires and everything else that comes along.
00:08:58 --> 00:09:02 But I mean, your story is about one family. I'm sure there were more.
00:09:03 --> 00:09:06 But the impact was that large for one.
00:09:06 --> 00:09:11 And sometimes even just venturing out to make that impact for one person or
00:09:11 --> 00:09:14 one family, it's worth all of that effort.
00:09:14 --> 00:09:18 I can give stories after stories now that's still happening,
00:09:18 --> 00:09:23 I was hosting an orientation and I was speaking and a parent got in late and
00:09:23 --> 00:09:24 it was very, it was crowded.
00:09:24 --> 00:09:29 Parents sits down and I can't take my eyes off this parent because I know this guy. I know him.
00:09:30 --> 00:09:34 I can't figure out who it is. So it became the assistant principal's time to talk.
00:09:35 --> 00:09:39 I went over to him and I said, excuse me, sir, but you look so familiar to me.
00:09:39 --> 00:09:42 My wife laughs because I think everybody looks familiar to me.
00:09:42 --> 00:09:46 So he looks at me and he goes, Mr. Witchman, it's
00:09:46 --> 00:09:49 me mark and i thought oh yeah i
00:09:49 --> 00:09:52 remember now it just took me right back yeah it was 99
00:09:52 --> 00:09:55 97 actually 97 is the
00:09:55 --> 00:09:59 last time i saw this young man yeah afterwards we're talking around and he told
00:09:59 --> 00:10:02 a story there was a bunch of parents standing around i'm sitting there he tells
00:10:02 --> 00:10:06 a story about so i never had mark as a student i had him as a coach in wrestling
00:10:06 --> 00:10:10 okay but it was in the middle school at that time and he tells a story about
00:10:10 --> 00:10:14 you saw me one morning and you knew something wasn't right.
00:10:14 --> 00:10:16 And you tried to talk to me. I wouldn't talk with you.
00:10:17 --> 00:10:21 You stayed with me. You followed me into my locker because you knew something wasn't right.
00:10:22 --> 00:10:25 Then you got me to another room and then I started crying.
00:10:26 --> 00:10:33 He said, you saw me not well at that moment and you stayed with me. Yeah.
00:10:34 --> 00:10:37 He had found out the night before that his parents were getting a divorce. Mm-hmm.
00:10:38 --> 00:10:43 What is that, 20 years, 25 years later, he's telling me this story that was
00:10:43 --> 00:10:44 just like one little thing.
00:10:45 --> 00:10:49 That doesn't happen if my experience in school doesn't see that character and
00:10:49 --> 00:10:51 nurture that along the way.
00:10:51 --> 00:10:57 And like you said, name the school. I mean, really, it's just their stories
00:10:57 --> 00:10:59 are there and we don't spend time celebrating them.
00:11:00 --> 00:11:03 We're just so worried about doing the next email, one more email,
00:11:03 --> 00:11:06 one more conversation, one more phone call, one more, one more,
00:11:06 --> 00:11:10 one more. and we forget our perspective when we just got to stop and celebrate. Just stop.
00:11:10 --> 00:11:12 I can go on to other situations as a principal.
00:11:13 --> 00:11:15 I'd have teachers say, Jim, it's time to slow down.
00:11:15 --> 00:11:18 So then I would say, okay, we're going to have forced family fun. Yeah.
00:11:19 --> 00:11:22 And then we would do something as a staff to kind of just like relax a little bit within there.
00:11:23 --> 00:11:26 And then not feel guilty about it. And not feel guilty about it,
00:11:26 --> 00:11:29 Mike. That's the hardest part, I think, sometimes. Yeah, we got to give ourselves permission.
00:11:30 --> 00:11:33 I know I'm still getting fired up with that, but that's exactly right,
00:11:33 --> 00:11:37 Adam. We got to give ourselves permission to keep ourself in the center.
00:11:37 --> 00:11:41 So if you think about yourself in the center and then maybe your spouse,
00:11:41 --> 00:11:43 girlfriend, whatever it is, kids on the outside of that ring.
00:11:44 --> 00:11:47 Probably the core values, right?
00:11:47 --> 00:11:51 You leave here, you find 10 people, you ask the first 10 people you see,
00:11:51 --> 00:11:54 or go to your work and ask them the first 10 people you see,
00:11:54 --> 00:11:55 what are your three core values?
00:11:56 --> 00:11:59 I bet you get zero people know what their three core values are.
00:12:00 --> 00:12:03 We're certainly going to stop and take a long time to think about it.
00:12:03 --> 00:12:06 Stop it. We don't take time for it because it's like, oh yeah,
00:12:06 --> 00:12:08 I know what they are. What? Do you?
00:12:08 --> 00:12:11 Yeah. Because here's what happens. When those, we don't know them,
00:12:11 --> 00:12:14 those core values get damaged, crossed, impacted.
00:12:15 --> 00:12:19 And we instantly go to emotional side because it hurts. But if we name them
00:12:19 --> 00:12:23 and wait, what if we shared them with people so that as you see that something's
00:12:23 --> 00:12:27 compromising my faith, my family, and my integrity, you're going to lean in.
00:12:27 --> 00:12:31 You're going to know that the day I take my mom to the care center,
00:12:31 --> 00:12:34 you're going to lean in to me and you're going to know that I need a little
00:12:34 --> 00:12:36 bit more support because we're humans.
00:12:36 --> 00:12:40 That vulnerability is hard for a lot of people because unfortunately,
00:12:40 --> 00:12:44 I think the mantra for some is that if I, if I show vulnerability,
00:12:44 --> 00:12:49 I show weakness and where it's, it's typically the opposite.
00:12:49 --> 00:12:53 It's honestly me being willing enough to say, Hey, I can't do it all.
00:12:54 --> 00:12:57 It's not possible to do it all, especially do it all.
00:12:57 --> 00:12:58 Well, having that ability to
00:12:58 --> 00:13:03 talk to somebody or to at least have a good colleague that you confide in.
00:13:03 --> 00:13:06 I mean, there's a lot of opportunities out there for people to be able to get
00:13:06 --> 00:13:11 a chance to get to that why or get to those core values. And it's okay not to
00:13:11 --> 00:13:14 do that all on your own. And in fact, it's probably better if you don't.
00:13:14 --> 00:13:19 The vulnerability you had asked me earlier about how, what was my journey and how did I evolve?
00:13:20 --> 00:13:25 I was forced vulnerability at times from my mistakes or from coaching. Well, we learn.
00:13:25 --> 00:13:28 Yeah, absolutely. Well, some of us learn quicker than others,
00:13:28 --> 00:13:30 but yeah, I can't say I'm one of those.
00:13:30 --> 00:13:34 But I remember one time being in my office, having a conversation with an instructional
00:13:34 --> 00:13:38 coach who our conversations, if you think of Brene Brown getting into the arena
00:13:38 --> 00:13:41 without armor on. Absolutely. like come for a cause. Yeah.
00:13:41 --> 00:13:45 Well, we've been in the arena with our armor on at times and our armor off. Sure.
00:13:45 --> 00:13:50 And one time we were in conversation and I was, I was so confused why people
00:13:50 --> 00:13:52 are so worried about taking chances or whatever the case is.
00:13:52 --> 00:13:57 And she closed her book and she said, she talked to my language. I understand.
00:13:57 --> 00:13:59 Do you, do you want to get real with this? You want me to tell you why?
00:13:59 --> 00:14:02 I'm like, yeah, tell me. I'm comfortable. Yeah.
00:14:02 --> 00:14:07 She said, you build a, recently you built a culture of compliance. Mm-hmm.
00:14:07 --> 00:14:11 I said, that's not true. Check the box. Yeah. I check in with Jim.
00:14:11 --> 00:14:12 Jim's going to do this. I didn't like that.
00:14:13 --> 00:14:18 I argued with her. And then she did something that I just, to this day, I'll never forget.
00:14:18 --> 00:14:21 She started naming examples, everything.
00:14:21 --> 00:14:26 She got to about eight and I got up and stormed out of my own office.
00:14:26 --> 00:14:32 She stayed. I walked around, came back, sat down and then said, where do we start?
00:14:32 --> 00:14:35 Now people would think you're the principal. You should know all this.
00:14:35 --> 00:14:37 Yeah. Well, yeah. That was the day.
00:14:37 --> 00:14:41 Yeah. That was the day when I learned it's not about me.
00:14:41 --> 00:14:47 The humans are working together. The title just tells us what our job role responsibilities is.
00:14:47 --> 00:14:53 And nowhere, nowhere on any job description for a principal does it say, know everything.
00:14:53 --> 00:14:56 Yeah, absolutely. But we think it's supposed to.
00:14:57 --> 00:15:03 And it's crazy. It's just crazy to me. So after that, we started leaning into the staff strengths.
00:15:03 --> 00:15:07 Professional development looked differently. Yeah. Because we started giving
00:15:07 --> 00:15:12 them the professional development that they needed. And started differentiating. Yeah.
00:15:12 --> 00:15:14 And I'm going to tell you, it was uncomfortable.
00:15:15 --> 00:15:19 But I found out, though, that I was the problem. Hi, me. I'm the problem.
00:15:19 --> 00:15:23 Because I was trying so hard to protect everything, everybody from things,
00:15:23 --> 00:15:27 that I didn't allow them the opportunity to lead, show their strength.
00:15:28 --> 00:15:34 And as a result, I started sliding myself back to the center because I could.
00:15:34 --> 00:15:36 Yeah. Gave yourself permission. In fact,
00:15:37 --> 00:15:40 We're talking about leaning into strengths. I remember sitting at a staff meeting.
00:15:41 --> 00:15:44 It's probably 80 people in there. And I'm trying to give directions.
00:15:45 --> 00:15:47 It's not my forte to give directions.
00:15:48 --> 00:15:53 And I remember someone in the audience raising their hand. Hey,
00:15:53 --> 00:15:55 Jim, love your enthusiasm.
00:15:55 --> 00:15:59 But do you think Kathleen, the assistant principal, can give the directions
00:15:59 --> 00:16:01 moving forward? Two things happen with that.
00:16:01 --> 00:16:05 One, I know you can see my body language just like, oh, God,
00:16:05 --> 00:16:08 yes. This is so stressful. gave me permission.
00:16:08 --> 00:16:11 You just gave me permission to give Kathleen permission. Exactly.
00:16:11 --> 00:16:16 Two, I modeled vulnerability with that. I guess in the third one would be,
00:16:16 --> 00:16:19 I also empowered someone else. Yeah.
00:16:20 --> 00:16:25 Yep. And how cool is that? Yeah. And certainly leaned into those strengths. So you talk about that.
00:16:25 --> 00:16:28 How do you, now in the role that you're in right now, okay.
00:16:28 --> 00:16:34 Yes. How do you help school leaders create an environment where they feel inspired
00:16:34 --> 00:16:37 to make meaningful change, like you're talking about.
00:16:37 --> 00:16:40 Because that meaningful change, typically when we use that term in education,
00:16:40 --> 00:16:45 we're talking about some sort of an initiative or something else we're going
00:16:45 --> 00:16:49 to, but really what you're talking about there is the meaningful change within yourself,
00:16:50 --> 00:16:53 within your culture, and just within how you do business.
00:16:54 --> 00:16:57 How do you inspire a leader to get to that part? There's a book.
00:17:00 --> 00:17:05 One book that kind of responds to here is called QBQ, Question Behind the Question by John Miller.
00:17:07 --> 00:17:10 39 chapters. Each chapter is about one to two pages. Love the book.
00:17:11 --> 00:17:15 In that one of those chapters, it says, it takes a play on the serenity prayer.
00:17:16 --> 00:17:18 God, grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change.
00:17:18 --> 00:17:19 Courage to change things, gain a wisdom, none of the difference.
00:17:20 --> 00:17:23 He says, God, grant me the serenity to accept the people I cannot change.
00:17:24 --> 00:17:28 Courage to change the one I can and wisdom to know that it's me.
00:17:29 --> 00:17:32 You see, you can't change a system if you don't look at yourself and see where
00:17:32 --> 00:17:36 you need to modify your operation, which is putting yourself back in the center.
00:17:37 --> 00:17:41 And if you were to talk about Jimmy, listen to Jimmy Costas podcast or,
00:17:41 --> 00:17:45 or read his books, he talks about, you can, you can lead from the perimeter.
00:17:45 --> 00:17:49 So you tell them to everybody what to do, or you can step in and really kind
00:17:49 --> 00:17:51 of name the issue and really lean into that.
00:17:52 --> 00:17:55 So when I'm working with people, whether it be as a coach, a workshop,
00:17:55 --> 00:17:59 or even as a keynote, you're not going to ever get me, I'm not going to ask
00:17:59 --> 00:18:02 you to fill out forms or you do these magical things and all of a sudden,
00:18:03 --> 00:18:04 poof, everything's great.
00:18:05 --> 00:18:09 Actually, that just drives people crazy. We also have people just doing their best.
00:18:09 --> 00:18:13 If they want to support the administrators, they pull them into a group.
00:18:13 --> 00:18:16 When they're pulling them into a group, you're not really necessarily differentiating,
00:18:16 --> 00:18:19 but we're pulling them away from a building and then whatever's done there,
00:18:19 --> 00:18:21 we lose. I walk with people.
00:18:22 --> 00:18:26 So I start with them. I get to know them, who they are, what they're about.
00:18:26 --> 00:18:28 I know their families. I know what they're trying to do.
00:18:29 --> 00:18:32 And once we get that relationship, that's pretty tight. Mm-hmm.
00:18:33 --> 00:18:36 Then it becomes real. And we talk about what do you want your name tagged to?
00:18:37 --> 00:18:40 Oh, I like that. When do you want to, are you ready to level up?
00:18:40 --> 00:18:44 And they'll say, what do you mean level up? Well, you've been swimming in this for a while.
00:18:44 --> 00:18:47 Okay. How about we level up? Because we level up.
00:18:48 --> 00:18:51 That means that we're taking care of a procedures, stretchers and everything
00:18:51 --> 00:18:53 else so that you can take care of yourself.
00:18:53 --> 00:19:00 I've had people text me and say, Hey Jim, I left school at four o'clock or whatever it is, early.
00:19:01 --> 00:19:04 And sometimes I'm like, celebrate the heck out of that. Yeah, no kidding.
00:19:04 --> 00:19:09 Sometimes I'll say, great, now let's go 30 minutes earlier. You can do it. You can do it. Yeah.
00:19:10 --> 00:19:13 And they just need that reassurance because a lot of times they don't give themselves
00:19:13 --> 00:19:16 permission to do so as well. So they're looking for some of that.
00:19:16 --> 00:19:21 And we'll look at the clarity concepts. Let's get it clear. Then they don't
00:19:21 --> 00:19:22 have the keep coming to you. Absolutely.
00:19:23 --> 00:19:26 Because otherwise our people are just putting out fires left and right,
00:19:26 --> 00:19:28 jumping on the hamster of will.
00:19:28 --> 00:19:31 We're just kind of struggling with that every day. You're just never even get
00:19:31 --> 00:19:35 a chance to breathe, let alone see the end of that tunnel, right? No, no.
00:19:35 --> 00:19:39 So you talked a little bit about your keynote speaking. I know that I have heard
00:19:39 --> 00:19:45 that your keynotes can often be described as more inspirational than motivational.
00:19:45 --> 00:19:49 And I get that. I can feel it here.
00:19:49 --> 00:19:52 But when you hear that, can you explain that difference to me?
00:19:52 --> 00:19:55 And why does the focus on inspiration really mean so much to you.
00:19:56 --> 00:19:59 Yeah, it does mean a lot to me. And so it really set me back.
00:19:59 --> 00:20:03 It was from an aspiring administrator in, in Arizona.
00:20:04 --> 00:20:09 Motivating to me is, is, you know, my football coach did a great job of motivating
00:20:09 --> 00:20:12 me. I'm going to get out there. I'm going to do this. It's a little spurt.
00:20:12 --> 00:20:16 But we all know that our motivation fades.
00:20:17 --> 00:20:21 Enter the month of February, enter the month of January, name it,
00:20:21 --> 00:20:24 whatever it is. Second armpit of the year that we're in right now.
00:20:24 --> 00:20:30 And we're there. So inspirational to me means that I said something or did something
00:20:30 --> 00:20:33 that struck an emotion inside of someone.
00:20:33 --> 00:20:36 An emotion that maybe they were wrestling with
00:20:36 --> 00:20:39 at some point along the way and that maybe I
00:20:39 --> 00:20:42 gave them permission to step into those emotions versus
00:20:42 --> 00:20:45 suppress those emotions you know
00:20:45 --> 00:20:48 when when people say we have these
00:20:48 --> 00:20:51 shatterings these shatterings go about you know where it could be something
00:20:51 --> 00:20:55 is a disruptor whether it be you're on your way to work and you get a flat tire
00:20:55 --> 00:21:00 in the rain okay you dazed hot for a little bit it's over it's over you're on
00:21:00 --> 00:21:05 the way to host a meeting as a principal or a teacher and your two-year-old
00:21:05 --> 00:21:08 throws up on your shoulder, just disrupts you.
00:21:08 --> 00:21:13 And it could be bigger events as life passes on some bigger events as well.
00:21:13 --> 00:21:19 But instead of stopping those down, saying what they are and stop trying to
00:21:19 --> 00:21:22 self-medicate by saying, it's okay, I'm good. It's okay, I'm good.
00:21:22 --> 00:21:23 He keeps shoving it down.
00:21:24 --> 00:21:27 Now, if people are listening to this, they'd probably say, oh my gosh,
00:21:27 --> 00:21:30 Jim, you say that. You used to say that all the time, which is true. That's true. Yeah. Yep.
00:21:31 --> 00:21:34 We all learn. We all learn, but I didn't learn for a while.
00:21:34 --> 00:21:39 I remember a teacher, teachers would get in conversations with me and they started
00:21:39 --> 00:21:42 sharing some personal things and I didn't know, really know how to help.
00:21:42 --> 00:21:47 But I did know that our school system had three free therapist visits. Yeah, absolutely.
00:21:47 --> 00:21:51 And so I'm like, I want to promote that I support mental health.
00:21:51 --> 00:21:54 So I actually encourage people to go there until I had one teacher ask me the
00:21:54 --> 00:22:00 question, what's it like at therapy, Jim? Um, well, I don't know. I've never been.
00:22:00 --> 00:22:03 Yeah. And in my head, I'm thinking, cause I don't need a therapist.
00:22:03 --> 00:22:06 I'm good. Just keep shoving things down.
00:22:06 --> 00:22:11 So I went, I went to a therapist and, and the first meeting was fine.
00:22:12 --> 00:22:15 I got two more. You'd know each other a little bit. Yeah. I could get to know
00:22:15 --> 00:22:17 each other a little bit. Yeah.
00:22:17 --> 00:22:20 I go to the second one and then it was the same thing.
00:22:20 --> 00:22:24 And then towards halfway through it, she said, what's your earliest memory as
00:22:24 --> 00:22:26 a kid? Yeah. Oh yeah. Sure. No problem.
00:22:26 --> 00:22:30 No problem. I was four years old. I woke up in the middle of the night by some noise.
00:22:30 --> 00:22:35 So I go out and I turn to my left and I see my dad on top of my mom with his hands around her neck.
00:22:36 --> 00:22:39 I think it was because something wasn't cleaned underneath the sink or something
00:22:39 --> 00:22:41 like that. And I can remember her saying, Jimmy's watching.
00:22:42 --> 00:22:44 But I was fine. I was good. There was some disruption there,
00:22:45 --> 00:22:46 but we got back on track. It was good.
00:22:47 --> 00:22:49 And then the therapist was looking
00:22:49 --> 00:22:51 at me now with a little different eyes wide open a little bit more.
00:22:52 --> 00:22:56 Hearing how easily it was for me to talk about this. So then she says,
00:22:56 --> 00:23:00 talk to me about your house, your bedroom, your car, whatever this is.
00:23:00 --> 00:23:02 And I thought, those are weird, but you're the therapist. Yeah,
00:23:02 --> 00:23:04 sure. I'll do what you'd ask me to do.
00:23:04 --> 00:23:06 I got a clean car. Always got a clean car. If you don't see my car clean,
00:23:06 --> 00:23:08 there's probably something going on.
00:23:08 --> 00:23:11 You know, my head, whatever the case is. I always like a clean counter.
00:23:12 --> 00:23:17 In the kitchen counter. I clean that counter and I swear the more I clean it,
00:23:17 --> 00:23:20 people want to put stuff on it. I clear it, put stuff on it.
00:23:20 --> 00:23:25 And she said, Jim, I think you're equating tidiness to safety.
00:23:25 --> 00:23:28 She said, next time when you come back, we're going to talk about that.
00:23:28 --> 00:23:32 I'm like, oh, this is going to be great because she's going to give me something
00:23:32 --> 00:23:35 I can say to my whole family that says, you guys have to pick up and how rude
00:23:35 --> 00:23:36 of you to be doing this to me.
00:23:37 --> 00:23:40 So I tell them, they're like, oh boy, I go back to Shannon the next time.
00:23:40 --> 00:23:45 And she says this to me and she goes, all right. And I got my notebook out and I'm ready to write.
00:23:45 --> 00:23:48 I'm going to write whatever she says. She says, okay, the next time you see
00:23:48 --> 00:23:51 that counter messy, next time I see that counter messy, as I write it down,
00:23:51 --> 00:23:56 she says, I want you to look at all the mess on there and say this.
00:23:56 --> 00:23:58 And then I wrote down, look at the mess.
00:23:59 --> 00:24:04 Say this, no matter what, under any circumstance, I'm safe.
00:24:04 --> 00:24:07 No matter what, under any circumstance, I said, I wrote it down,
00:24:07 --> 00:24:11 And I underlined it. Yeah. No matter what, under any circumstance, I'm safe. Okay.
00:24:11 --> 00:24:15 So I say, I say that. Then what? She goes, then you can go put the stuff wherever it goes.
00:24:16 --> 00:24:19 Put the stuff I wrote down. Put the stuff wherever it goes. And I'm writing
00:24:19 --> 00:24:22 it because I'm pressing on my paper. I'm underlining and everything.
00:24:22 --> 00:24:24 And then I said, then what?
00:24:24 --> 00:24:27 And then she said, just go buy your business. Yeah.
00:24:28 --> 00:24:32 Because you get the choice to get angry at everybody or know that you're safe.
00:24:33 --> 00:24:34 See, Jim, you have to retrain your brain.
00:24:35 --> 00:24:36 The clutter doesn't mean you're not safe.
00:24:37 --> 00:24:41 Just means that how you internalize it. Yeah. So I go home and I'm ready to
00:24:41 --> 00:24:43 tell everybody, you know, I'm thinking of the thought I was going to come home
00:24:43 --> 00:24:44 and tell everybody this.
00:24:44 --> 00:24:48 They're waiting for me. They know that the thunder's coming or whatever the case is.
00:24:49 --> 00:24:55 And I told them just like I told you. And then I said, I guess therapy is all about me.
00:24:55 --> 00:25:00 And then I just walked off. Now I say that story because I think it's okay that
00:25:00 --> 00:25:04 people know that I go to a therapist. Yeah, sure. In fact, that was having so much success.
00:25:04 --> 00:25:07 This is probably five, six years ago. So much success. The therapist says, Jim, so we're good?
00:25:08 --> 00:25:11 I'm like, wait a second. Are you breaking up with me? No, I'll see you next
00:25:11 --> 00:25:13 month. I mean, I need that regular basis.
00:25:13 --> 00:25:17 But I say that not just to celebrate the power of therapy.
00:25:18 --> 00:25:21 I say that because that just gave me freedom.
00:25:22 --> 00:25:26 You know, the distance between a stimulus and a response, the greater you can
00:25:26 --> 00:25:31 create that space, the more freedom we have in the rational sense of mind. I like that.
00:25:31 --> 00:25:35 And the more that we have that opportunity to do so. So when you go back to
00:25:35 --> 00:25:37 when you were talking to me about the principles and everything's coming out
00:25:37 --> 00:25:42 of it, that space is narrowing because we think that everything has to be done right away.
00:25:43 --> 00:25:45 We do need to have it done within our time frame. Sure.
00:25:47 --> 00:25:52 But we can build capacity within a system. And the bigger the capacity is and
00:25:52 --> 00:25:56 have those clear expectations, the more we can keep ourself at the center.
00:25:56 --> 00:26:02 You see, I got better as a principal because I had people, I allowed people to lean in and help me.
00:26:03 --> 00:26:07 I allowed people to see me as a human. In fact, they would often,
00:26:07 --> 00:26:10 it's at one point in my career, they would say, you don't really know us.
00:26:11 --> 00:26:17 And I thought I did until I didn't, which means I needed to sit down and I needed
00:26:17 --> 00:26:19 to listen instead of trying to solve people's problems.
00:26:20 --> 00:26:21 You just needed to listen sometimes.
00:26:22 --> 00:26:27 Well, Jim, before we let you go here, I do want to ask you one question,
00:26:27 --> 00:26:30 and that is, what are you most excited about?
00:26:30 --> 00:26:34 I mean, we get caught in the, yes, this job is hard, and there's a lot going
00:26:34 --> 00:26:41 on in politics and in everything around the world of education today.
00:26:41 --> 00:26:45 However, there's still a lot of exciting things that are going on in education
00:26:45 --> 00:26:48 too. It's hard to see them sometimes because we get caught up in the other.
00:26:49 --> 00:26:54 What are you most excited about today about what you see in the field of education?
00:26:54 --> 00:27:00 You are correct. We don't make the time to celebrate those little things.
00:27:01 --> 00:27:05 First of all, our energy changes. And second of all, our kids deserve us to
00:27:05 --> 00:27:07 celebrate versus blasting us.
00:27:07 --> 00:27:10 So you see, we can't control all this politics. I mean, you can vote,
00:27:10 --> 00:27:18 but we can't control what the public says, but what we can do is we can define our narrative.
00:27:18 --> 00:27:23 It's kind of like, if you were to ask me, I wonder what my legacy will be when I leave.
00:27:23 --> 00:27:28 How about you define your legacy and then live the behaviors that support that?
00:27:29 --> 00:27:31 School systems, the people that work in education, the schools,
00:27:31 --> 00:27:36 they have a lot more control than they believe they can because no one's stopping
00:27:36 --> 00:27:40 us from celebrating each other. No one's stopping us for being there or being
00:27:40 --> 00:27:41 vulnerable with each other.
00:27:42 --> 00:27:47 What excites me about this opportunity that I'm in now is I get to be a part
00:27:47 --> 00:27:51 of disrupting the negative, clear it out a little bit so people can see the
00:27:51 --> 00:27:52 superpowers that each one of
00:27:52 --> 00:27:56 them has, and then bring it together like the Justice League, if you will.
00:27:56 --> 00:28:02 And we do that by simple actions, reading people, complimenting their clothes,
00:28:02 --> 00:28:06 complimenting the work they did, sitting in the classroom just to celebrate
00:28:06 --> 00:28:08 the magic that each teacher does.
00:28:08 --> 00:28:11 It takes seconds to minutes to do so.
00:28:11 --> 00:28:14 But the impact is huge. The impact is huge. Huge.
00:28:15 --> 00:28:19 So if I go back to Otoma, they sent me to a conference one time in that conference
00:28:19 --> 00:28:23 of leadership conference. I always joke because it's true that I flew my first
00:28:23 --> 00:28:27 airplane that time. And I was, they, they, they upgraded me to the non-smoking
00:28:27 --> 00:28:30 section on the airplane. If you remember that. Oh yeah.
00:28:30 --> 00:28:35 But I was all in my feels and Terrell had said to me, Hey Jimmy,
00:28:35 --> 00:28:40 you don't have to move the world to shake it as you go by.
00:28:40 --> 00:28:43 I didn't know what it meant then. I clearly know what it means now.
00:28:44 --> 00:28:48 It's doing what you're doing, Adam. It's your, you're, you're getting a message
00:28:48 --> 00:28:50 out that there's a lot of great things in education.
00:28:51 --> 00:28:54 It's talking with people. It's joking with people. It's, it's,
00:28:54 --> 00:28:57 it's celebrating the little things, the glasses, the bracelets,
00:28:57 --> 00:29:01 whatever the case is, it's the little things that matter.
00:29:02 --> 00:29:06 And if we do a lot more shaking the world as we go by, then we've got something
00:29:06 --> 00:29:10 really special and educators are leaning into each other.
00:29:10 --> 00:29:13 And before too long, the parents are going to come back and we're going to be doing this.
00:29:14 --> 00:29:17 I've been blessed that parents have been so supportive of me. Mm-hmm.
00:29:17 --> 00:29:21 I just want everybody else to feel that same experience or that same excitement.
00:29:22 --> 00:29:27 I feel very honored to be a part of here representing Inspired Edification and
00:29:27 --> 00:29:28 Jay Casas and Associates.
00:29:29 --> 00:29:31 I'm a senior associate there.
00:29:32 --> 00:29:37 That's what it is. We're humans supporting humans who are supporting humans.
00:29:37 --> 00:29:41 Well, that is awesome, Jim. I thank you. Can't even begin to thank you enough
00:29:41 --> 00:29:44 for jumping on today. Your story is just amazing.
00:29:44 --> 00:29:48 And if you're wanting to hear more of this story and be able to get some of
00:29:48 --> 00:29:50 Jim's work alongside your work, because that's what it's going to be.
00:29:50 --> 00:29:54 It's going to be right next to you as you work through your challenges every day as well.
00:29:54 --> 00:29:57 In the information within this podcast, you will find all that information that
00:29:57 --> 00:30:01 you need to be able to get a hold of Jim. We've got his information on our AWB
00:30:01 --> 00:30:02 Education webpage as well.
00:30:03 --> 00:30:05 Jim, one more time, thanks again for joining me today. I love this,
00:30:06 --> 00:30:07 Adam. Thank you very much for having me here.
00:30:07 --> 00:30:11 Thank you for listening to this episode of your Booster Shot from AWB Education.
00:30:12 --> 00:30:16 Want to join in this mission? We are always looking for partners to help provide
00:30:16 --> 00:30:19 what our school leaders need to thrive and survive.
00:30:19 --> 00:30:25 Contact us through our webpage at www.awbeducation.org to get connected.
00:30:26 --> 00:30:30 Otherwise, remember you are doing the job that only a few are strong enough to do.
00:30:30 --> 00:30:34 Thanks for being one of the few. We will talk with you again next time.